I have never visited the Vietnam Veterans Memorial in Washington, D.C. I was near it in 1997 when I attended a Promise Keepers’ meeting in D.C., but the crowd attending that gathering was large and my time limited; I decided not to try to visit the memorial that day.
According to
“Wikipedia,” the Vietnam Veterans Memorial honors service members of the U.S. armed forces who fought in the Vietnam
War, service members who died in service in Vietnam/South East Asia,
and those service members who were unaccounted for (Missing In Action) during
the War.
The Memorial
Wall, designed by American architect Maya
Lin, currently consists of three separate parts: the Three Soldiers statue, the Vietnam Women's Memorial, and the
Vietnam Veterans Memorial Wall,’
Stone for the
wall came from Bangalore, Karnataka, India, and was chosen
because of its reflective quality. When a visitor looks upon the wall, his or
her reflection can be seen simultaneously with the engraved names – an effect
intended to symbolically bring the past and present together. As of May 2011, there were
58,272 names (including eight women’s names) engraved on the wall.
During the 1980s, I saw the
traveling version of the Vietnam Veterans Memorial wall in Greenville, S.C.
That “moving wall” is a 3/5-scale replica of the permanent memorial wall in
Washington, D.C.; it stands six feet tall at the center and covers almost 300 feet
from end to end (www.themovingwall.org).
Many people who visited that
touring wall touched names on the wall; some laid flowers and notes at the
wall’s base.
I served in Vietnam for almost all
of 1971 as an U.S. Army GI – “GI” stood for “Government Issue,” but by World War II “GI” had
become a nickname for military personnel. I never saw combat and experienced
an easy “tour of duty.”
I knew at least two men whose
names are engraved on the Vietnam Veterans Memorial wall.
I attended Greer High School
(Greer, S.C.) with Ronnie Eugene Norris and his brother Tommy, both likable
fellows. Ronnie was in one of my high school gym classes. I remember seeing Ronnie
adjust his glasses with a sweaty hand before serving as we played volleyball outside
the gym on a spring day. He put the ball over the net. We were just boys,
goofing around, having fun.
Shortly after his high school experience,
Ronnie ended up in the army. When I heard of his death in Vietnam, I envisioned
his laughing face as he served during a volleyball game. According to available
records, “RONNIE
EUGENE NORRIS” is honored on Panel 13E, Row 85 of the Vietnam Veterans
Memorial. Born in 1945, Ronnie died on December 27, 1966, in Binh Dinh
Province, South Vietnam. He reportedly died “outright” as a “ground casualty”
of hostile “gun or small arms fire” as he participated in an “unspecified
operation.” His body was recovered. Ronnie served as a private first class (MOS
13A10: Field Artillery Basic) and as a member of C Battery, 6TH BN, 16TH
Artillery, 1ST CAV DIV, USARV (U.S. Army Republic of Vietnam).
I met Stanley Norris Green from Macon,
Georgia, at Bob Jones University in Greenville, S.C. I didn’t know Stan well,
but he and I were art students at BJU and members of the same school “society.”
The university had no sororities or fraternities, but it required that every
student be a member of one of many “literary societies.” Those societies met
weekly (on Wednesdays) around noon and served as social and service
organizations and sponsors for intramural sports teams. Stan and I belonged to
“Lanier,” a society named for Sidney Lanier, a Georgia poet.
The son of an evangelist, Stan was a handsome
young man who possessed a friendly, outgoing personality. He did well in art,
but for some reason he seemed restless and enlisted in the army.
Stan served for a year in Vietnam and
returned to BJU for a visit (I think he visited the school in the spring of
1967). Our societies met in university classrooms, and when Stan visited our
Lanier meeting, he sat on a professor’s desk and related some positive things
about his Vietnam experiences. He seemed relaxed and proud of his service in
Southeast Asia. He appeared to have found a “cause” and seemed happy and at
peace. He told us he had reenlisted.
“STANLEY NORRIS GREEN” is honored on Panel W38,
line 26 of the Vietnam Veterans Memorial. Born in 1947, Stan died on November
21, 1968, in Binh Thuan Province, South Vietnam. He reportedly died of “hostile
wounds” sustained from an “air loss or crash over land” when he served on a
helicopter (“non-crew”) – meaning that the helicopter he rode was probably shot
down. His body was recovered. Stan served as an infantryman, a sergeant (E5)
with an MOS of 11D40: Armor Reconnaissance Specialist. Stan served as a member
of B Troop, 7TH SQDN, 17TH Cavalry, 1ST Aviation Brigade, USARV (U.S. Army
Republic of Vietnam).
I often think of Ronnie Norris and Stan Green.
Years ago, I never dreamed their names would be engraved on the Vietnam
Veterans Memorial wall.
Pictured is The Vietnam Veterans Memorial Wall in Washington, D.C.
------------------
In October 2013, I (Steve Crain) received the following e-mail from Cindi Engle Bolden:
---------------
Linda Passwaters sent to me (Steve Crain) the following e-mail in July 2013:
Dear Steve,
Thank you for posting the photo and article about Stan Green. I met Stan in 1967 while he was at Fort Bragg for several months before he was killed in Vietnam. He was staying with an Army buddy, and I had the opportunity to join them for a day at the beach. He was such a nice young man, so polite and courteous. My father liked him right away.
We only met once or twice, so I don’t know much about Stan, but your article filled in several gaps. I do remember him talking about art and how much he liked to draw and also about how he had left college to join the Army. He talked a lot about his parents, especially his Mother. He told me that she was a speech therapist and preceded to tell funny stories about her. As a Mother of two sons my heart goes out to her for her loss. I have often thought about him and wondered who he was and what he might have been.
I am sorry about going on and on, but this is the first time I’ve spoken to someone about him since that summer in 1968. If you don’t mind, please go to http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GSln=Green&GSfn=Stanley&GSmn=Norris&GSbyrel=all&GSdyrel=all&GSob=n&GRid=18409329&df=all& . There you will find a memorial to Stan with a photo of his grave marker as well as a copy of the photo you posted of him. I am trying to keep his memory alive by maintaining the site. Please feel free to leave a short message there.
Sincerely,
Linda Passwaters
Shown below is a photo of Stan Green's grave marker as displayed in the Mount Hebron West Cemetery, Elmore, Elmore County, Alabama, USA:
Information on U.S. Army helicopter OH-6A tail number 67-16355
The Army purchased this helicopter 0968
Total flight hours at this point: 00000047
Date: 11/21/1968
Incident number: 68112101.KIA
Unit: B/7/17 CAV
This was a Combat incident. This helicopter was LOSS TO INVENTORY
This was a Recon mission for Unarmed Recon
Unknown this helicopter was Unknown at UNK feet and UNK knots.
Unknown
UTM grid coordinates: AN962487
Count of hits was not possible because the helicopter burned or exploded.
Small Arms/Automatic Weapons; Gun launched non-explosive ballistic projectiles less than 20 mm in size. (7.62MM)
Systems damaged were: PERSONNEL
Casualties = 02 DOI . .
The helicopter Crashed. Aircraft Destroyed.
Both mission and flight capability were terminated.
Burned
Original source(s) and document(s) from which the incident was created or updated: Defense Intelligence Agency Helicopter Loss database. Survivability/Vulnerability Information Analysis Center Helicopter database. Also: OPERA, LNOF, 80466, CASRP, CRAFX, JSIDR, HUGHS, Joe Shepherd (Operations Report. Lindenmuth Old Format Data Base. Joint Services Incident Damage Report. Crash Facts Message. Casualty Report. )
Summary: Shot down and destroyed by a group of VC during a BDA after a Cobra rocket attack during a VR mission.
Loss to Inventory
Crew Members:
P 1LT WELDING CLIFFORD KAY KIA
OB SGT GREEN STANLEY NORRIS KIA
------------------
In October 2013, I (Steve Crain) received the following e-mail from Cindi Engle Bolden:
Sin13 said...
Dear Steve,
Thank you for honoring Ronnie in your post. I have never met him or his family, but I have lived my whole 36 years knowing of him as family.
My dad [Bobby Joe Engle] served in Vietnam with Ronnie and was there when he was killed. My father was also injured, and he has recently passed due to agent orange exposure while serving. It's been almost 2 years.
Last year, we went to the Wall for the In Memory program to honor my father and those who have died from their service but are not eligible to be on the wall. In the end, my father's memorial picture was 2 panels away from Ronnie's name, which I thought was very fitting.
My father talked of Ronnie often and said that he was his best friend. I imagine that their time serving together brought them pretty close as my grandmother and aunts have been in touch with Ronnie's family since the war. Ronnie's death devastated and haunted my father for the rest of his life, it was a big loss to him and for me personally as well. My father never got over that, and the talks we had left me with a lifetime of wondering and imagining.
Our trip to the wall was one of the most emotional things I have ever done, not just because of the loss of my father but because of his stories and my eagerness to learn and understand our Vets and the war. The loss, suffering and flat out neglect of our Vietnam Vets breaks my heart and leaves a heavy burden that I sometimes wish I didn't have to carry, but I always will.
I have several pictures of Ronnie in my dad's Vietnam album that I would like to share with you, I'm not sure how though.
If you aren't already, I encourage you to become involved with the Vietnam Veterans Memorial Fund. http://www.vvmf.org/.
Thank you again for your post and please know that there is another family out here that regularly honors and thinks of Ronnie.
Proud Daughter of a Vietnam Vet,
Cindi Engle Bolden
Shown below are photos of Ronnie Eugene Norris, taken by Cindi's father while in Vietnam in 1967.
Thank you for honoring Ronnie in your post. I have never met him or his family, but I have lived my whole 36 years knowing of him as family.
My dad [Bobby Joe Engle] served in Vietnam with Ronnie and was there when he was killed. My father was also injured, and he has recently passed due to agent orange exposure while serving. It's been almost 2 years.
Last year, we went to the Wall for the In Memory program to honor my father and those who have died from their service but are not eligible to be on the wall. In the end, my father's memorial picture was 2 panels away from Ronnie's name, which I thought was very fitting.
My father talked of Ronnie often and said that he was his best friend. I imagine that their time serving together brought them pretty close as my grandmother and aunts have been in touch with Ronnie's family since the war. Ronnie's death devastated and haunted my father for the rest of his life, it was a big loss to him and for me personally as well. My father never got over that, and the talks we had left me with a lifetime of wondering and imagining.
Our trip to the wall was one of the most emotional things I have ever done, not just because of the loss of my father but because of his stories and my eagerness to learn and understand our Vets and the war. The loss, suffering and flat out neglect of our Vietnam Vets breaks my heart and leaves a heavy burden that I sometimes wish I didn't have to carry, but I always will.
I have several pictures of Ronnie in my dad's Vietnam album that I would like to share with you, I'm not sure how though.
If you aren't already, I encourage you to become involved with the Vietnam Veterans Memorial Fund. http://www.vvmf.org/.
Thank you again for your post and please know that there is another family out here that regularly honors and thinks of Ronnie.
Proud Daughter of a Vietnam Vet,
Cindi Engle Bolden
Shown below are photos of Ronnie Eugene Norris, taken by Cindi's father while in Vietnam in 1967.
Linda Passwaters sent to me (Steve Crain) the following e-mail in July 2013:
Dear Steve,
Thank you for posting the photo and article about Stan Green. I met Stan in 1967 while he was at Fort Bragg for several months before he was killed in Vietnam. He was staying with an Army buddy, and I had the opportunity to join them for a day at the beach. He was such a nice young man, so polite and courteous. My father liked him right away.
We only met once or twice, so I don’t know much about Stan, but your article filled in several gaps. I do remember him talking about art and how much he liked to draw and also about how he had left college to join the Army. He talked a lot about his parents, especially his Mother. He told me that she was a speech therapist and preceded to tell funny stories about her. As a Mother of two sons my heart goes out to her for her loss. I have often thought about him and wondered who he was and what he might have been.
I am sorry about going on and on, but this is the first time I’ve spoken to someone about him since that summer in 1968. If you don’t mind, please go to http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GSln=Green&GSfn=Stanley&GSmn=Norris&GSbyrel=all&GSdyrel=all&GSob=n&GRid=18409329&df=all& . There you will find a memorial to Stan with a photo of his grave marker as well as a copy of the photo you posted of him. I am trying to keep his memory alive by maintaining the site. Please feel free to leave a short message there.
Sincerely,
Linda Passwaters
Shown below is a photo of Stan Green's grave marker as displayed in the Mount Hebron West Cemetery, Elmore, Elmore County, Alabama, USA:
----------------------
In
February 2014, Stephan Howard, who attended church with Stan Green when
Howard was a boy, e-mailed me and said, “Cliff Welding was the
oh6 Loach helicopter Pilot with Stan Green in the aircraft with him
[Green] as
observer. They were flying wing on the mission for Joe Shepherd in the
lead
helicopter. They were working as a pink team (2 oh6 helicopters, 2 cobra
helicopters), and went back to assess the cobra's attack damage on a
trailed
group of VC and they were hit.”
S. Howard referred me to an internet site that contains more information:
that yielded this information:
"Cliff Welding and SGT Green were flying
my wing that day. We were covered by two cobras and were following a fresh
trail from an over-night contact into the foothills. We caught a group of 8-10
VC on the trail. Cliff and I both engaged with mini-guns and fire from our
observers. We dropped smoke and the cobras rolled in as we moved off to the
west. After making several passes, the cobra lead called us back for a BDA.
Cliff's mini-gun had stopped working so he led back into the area and I
followed to cover him. As we neared the smoke from the cobra's rockets we
received small arms fire. Then Cliff's aircraft was hit by an RPG. It went down
immediatley! I tried to land but could not because of small arms fire. I could
see that Cliff was still in the burning aircraft and that SGT Green was out, but
that he was burned very bad. I stayed on station until the Blues arrived and
confirmed that Cliff was KIA and SGT Green was medevaced."
Submitted by Joe
Shepherd, Scalp Hunter 15
This record was last updated on
10/22/1999
The full report accompanying the above site lists this information:
Information on U.S. Army helicopter OH-6A tail number 67-16355
The Army purchased this helicopter 0968
Total flight hours at this point: 00000047
Date: 11/21/1968
Incident number: 68112101.KIA
Unit: B/7/17 CAV
This was a Combat incident. This helicopter was LOSS TO INVENTORY
This was a Recon mission for Unarmed Recon
Unknown this helicopter was Unknown at UNK feet and UNK knots.
Unknown
UTM grid coordinates: AN962487
Count of hits was not possible because the helicopter burned or exploded.
Small Arms/Automatic Weapons; Gun launched non-explosive ballistic projectiles less than 20 mm in size. (7.62MM)
Systems damaged were: PERSONNEL
Casualties = 02 DOI . .
The helicopter Crashed. Aircraft Destroyed.
Both mission and flight capability were terminated.
Burned
Original source(s) and document(s) from which the incident was created or updated: Defense Intelligence Agency Helicopter Loss database. Survivability/Vulnerability Information Analysis Center Helicopter database. Also: OPERA, LNOF, 80466, CASRP, CRAFX, JSIDR, HUGHS, Joe Shepherd (Operations Report. Lindenmuth Old Format Data Base. Joint Services Incident Damage Report. Crash Facts Message. Casualty Report. )
Summary: Shot down and destroyed by a group of VC during a BDA after a Cobra rocket attack during a VR mission.
Loss to Inventory
Crew Members:
P 1LT WELDING CLIFFORD KAY KIA
OB SGT GREEN STANLEY NORRIS KIA
